Question about a function that is a ratio of gamma functions and appears to be strictly increasing for $xge...











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I was surprised to discover that the following function appears to be strictly increasing for $x ge 2$:



$$f(x) = frac{Gamma(x+1)}{Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{3}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{5}+1)}$$



when I tested out different values of $x$ using Excel.



I had assumed that it would be decreasing since $x < frac{x}{2} + frac{x}{3} + frac{x}{5}$.



I wanted to verify this is true by checking the derivative.



It seemed to me that the right way to do this is to use this series of the digamma function so that:



$$frac{d}{dx}left(ln Gamma(x+1) - ln Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{3}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{5}+1)right) =$$



$$ psi(x+1) - frac{psi(frac{x}{2}+1)}{2} - frac{psi(frac{x}{3}+1)}{3}-frac{psi(frac{x}{5}+1}{5}=$$



$$frac{gamma}{6}+ sum_{k=0}^{infty}left(frac{-1}{30k+30}-frac{1}{k+x+1} + frac{1}{2k+x+2} + frac{1}{3k+x+3} + frac{1}{5k+x+5}right)$$



It is not obvious to me that this derivative is greater than $0$ for $x ge 2$



How would I complete the derivative to reach my conclusion about whether this function is strictly increasing or not for $x ge 2$?










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This question has an open bounty worth +50
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Looking for an answer drawing from credible and/or official sources.


Hoping that someone will help me complete the analysis of whether the function is increasing or not.
















  • Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
    – Yuriy S
    yesterday















up vote
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I was surprised to discover that the following function appears to be strictly increasing for $x ge 2$:



$$f(x) = frac{Gamma(x+1)}{Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{3}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{5}+1)}$$



when I tested out different values of $x$ using Excel.



I had assumed that it would be decreasing since $x < frac{x}{2} + frac{x}{3} + frac{x}{5}$.



I wanted to verify this is true by checking the derivative.



It seemed to me that the right way to do this is to use this series of the digamma function so that:



$$frac{d}{dx}left(ln Gamma(x+1) - ln Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{3}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{5}+1)right) =$$



$$ psi(x+1) - frac{psi(frac{x}{2}+1)}{2} - frac{psi(frac{x}{3}+1)}{3}-frac{psi(frac{x}{5}+1}{5}=$$



$$frac{gamma}{6}+ sum_{k=0}^{infty}left(frac{-1}{30k+30}-frac{1}{k+x+1} + frac{1}{2k+x+2} + frac{1}{3k+x+3} + frac{1}{5k+x+5}right)$$



It is not obvious to me that this derivative is greater than $0$ for $x ge 2$



How would I complete the derivative to reach my conclusion about whether this function is strictly increasing or not for $x ge 2$?










share|cite|improve this question















This question has an open bounty worth +50
reputation from Larry Freeman ending in 3 days.


Looking for an answer drawing from credible and/or official sources.


Hoping that someone will help me complete the analysis of whether the function is increasing or not.
















  • Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
    – Yuriy S
    yesterday













up vote
8
down vote

favorite
3









up vote
8
down vote

favorite
3






3





I was surprised to discover that the following function appears to be strictly increasing for $x ge 2$:



$$f(x) = frac{Gamma(x+1)}{Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{3}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{5}+1)}$$



when I tested out different values of $x$ using Excel.



I had assumed that it would be decreasing since $x < frac{x}{2} + frac{x}{3} + frac{x}{5}$.



I wanted to verify this is true by checking the derivative.



It seemed to me that the right way to do this is to use this series of the digamma function so that:



$$frac{d}{dx}left(ln Gamma(x+1) - ln Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{3}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{5}+1)right) =$$



$$ psi(x+1) - frac{psi(frac{x}{2}+1)}{2} - frac{psi(frac{x}{3}+1)}{3}-frac{psi(frac{x}{5}+1}{5}=$$



$$frac{gamma}{6}+ sum_{k=0}^{infty}left(frac{-1}{30k+30}-frac{1}{k+x+1} + frac{1}{2k+x+2} + frac{1}{3k+x+3} + frac{1}{5k+x+5}right)$$



It is not obvious to me that this derivative is greater than $0$ for $x ge 2$



How would I complete the derivative to reach my conclusion about whether this function is strictly increasing or not for $x ge 2$?










share|cite|improve this question













I was surprised to discover that the following function appears to be strictly increasing for $x ge 2$:



$$f(x) = frac{Gamma(x+1)}{Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{3}+1)Gamma(frac{x}{5}+1)}$$



when I tested out different values of $x$ using Excel.



I had assumed that it would be decreasing since $x < frac{x}{2} + frac{x}{3} + frac{x}{5}$.



I wanted to verify this is true by checking the derivative.



It seemed to me that the right way to do this is to use this series of the digamma function so that:



$$frac{d}{dx}left(ln Gamma(x+1) - ln Gamma(frac{x}{2}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{3}+1) - lnGamma(frac{x}{5}+1)right) =$$



$$ psi(x+1) - frac{psi(frac{x}{2}+1)}{2} - frac{psi(frac{x}{3}+1)}{3}-frac{psi(frac{x}{5}+1}{5}=$$



$$frac{gamma}{6}+ sum_{k=0}^{infty}left(frac{-1}{30k+30}-frac{1}{k+x+1} + frac{1}{2k+x+2} + frac{1}{3k+x+3} + frac{1}{5k+x+5}right)$$



It is not obvious to me that this derivative is greater than $0$ for $x ge 2$



How would I complete the derivative to reach my conclusion about whether this function is strictly increasing or not for $x ge 2$?







derivatives gamma-function






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asked Nov 8 at 16:59









Larry Freeman

3,22921238




3,22921238






This question has an open bounty worth +50
reputation from Larry Freeman ending in 3 days.


Looking for an answer drawing from credible and/or official sources.


Hoping that someone will help me complete the analysis of whether the function is increasing or not.








This question has an open bounty worth +50
reputation from Larry Freeman ending in 3 days.


Looking for an answer drawing from credible and/or official sources.


Hoping that someone will help me complete the analysis of whether the function is increasing or not.














  • Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
    – Yuriy S
    yesterday


















  • Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
    – Yuriy S
    yesterday
















Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
– Yuriy S
yesterday




Just in case, here's a simple R algorithm for digamma function, which uses its asymptotic approximation and functional equation: zm <- 20; psi <- function(z){if(z < zm){k <- floor(zm-z)}else{k <- 0}; return(log(z+k+1)-1/2/(z+k+1)-1/12/(z+k+1)^2-sum(1/(z+0:k)))}; you can increase the accuracy by increasing zm. The R environment is free and open source.
– Yuriy S
yesterday










1 Answer
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Stirling's approximation says that $log Gamma(z) sim z log z + O(z)$. So $$log Gamma(alpha x + 1)sim (alpha x + 1)log(alpha x + 1)+O(x)sim alpha x log x + O(x),$$
and so certainly $log f(x)sim -frac{1}{30}xlog x + O(x)$: your function must, eventually, start decreasing asymptotically to zero. But eventually is important. Let's try to estimate where this happens.



Consider the ratio $f(30y+30) / f(30y)$, where $y$ is an integer. You have
$$
frac{f(30y+30)}{f(30y)}=frac{Gamma(30y+31)Gamma(15y+1)Gamma(10y+1)Gamma(6y+1)}{Gamma(30y+1)Gamma(15y+16)Gamma(10y+11)Gamma(6y+7)}=frac{(30y+30)!(15y)!(10y)!(6y)!}{(30y)!(15y+15)!(10y+10)!(6y+6)!}=frac{(30y+30)(30y+29)cdots(30y+1)}{(15y+15)(15y+14)cdots(15y+1)cdot(10y+10)cdots(10y+1)cdot(6y+6)cdots(6y+1)}approxfrac{30^{30}}{15^{15}10^{10}6^{6}}frac{1}{y}=frac{1.008times10^{12}}{y},
$$

where the $approx$ is arrived at by pulling out the prefactors, counting powers of $y$, and ignoring the additive terms (which is justified when $y$ is large). This is going to be less than $1$ eventually... when $y$ exceeds a trillion. Your function will start decreasing when $x$ is greater than about $3times 10^{13}.$ By that point, $f(x)$ will have many trillions of decimal digits, which I dare say is a bit more than Excel can handle.






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  • Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
    – Larry Freeman
    18 mins ago











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1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes








1 Answer
1






active

oldest

votes









active

oldest

votes






active

oldest

votes








up vote
5
down vote



accepted










Stirling's approximation says that $log Gamma(z) sim z log z + O(z)$. So $$log Gamma(alpha x + 1)sim (alpha x + 1)log(alpha x + 1)+O(x)sim alpha x log x + O(x),$$
and so certainly $log f(x)sim -frac{1}{30}xlog x + O(x)$: your function must, eventually, start decreasing asymptotically to zero. But eventually is important. Let's try to estimate where this happens.



Consider the ratio $f(30y+30) / f(30y)$, where $y$ is an integer. You have
$$
frac{f(30y+30)}{f(30y)}=frac{Gamma(30y+31)Gamma(15y+1)Gamma(10y+1)Gamma(6y+1)}{Gamma(30y+1)Gamma(15y+16)Gamma(10y+11)Gamma(6y+7)}=frac{(30y+30)!(15y)!(10y)!(6y)!}{(30y)!(15y+15)!(10y+10)!(6y+6)!}=frac{(30y+30)(30y+29)cdots(30y+1)}{(15y+15)(15y+14)cdots(15y+1)cdot(10y+10)cdots(10y+1)cdot(6y+6)cdots(6y+1)}approxfrac{30^{30}}{15^{15}10^{10}6^{6}}frac{1}{y}=frac{1.008times10^{12}}{y},
$$

where the $approx$ is arrived at by pulling out the prefactors, counting powers of $y$, and ignoring the additive terms (which is justified when $y$ is large). This is going to be less than $1$ eventually... when $y$ exceeds a trillion. Your function will start decreasing when $x$ is greater than about $3times 10^{13}.$ By that point, $f(x)$ will have many trillions of decimal digits, which I dare say is a bit more than Excel can handle.






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
    – Larry Freeman
    18 mins ago















up vote
5
down vote



accepted










Stirling's approximation says that $log Gamma(z) sim z log z + O(z)$. So $$log Gamma(alpha x + 1)sim (alpha x + 1)log(alpha x + 1)+O(x)sim alpha x log x + O(x),$$
and so certainly $log f(x)sim -frac{1}{30}xlog x + O(x)$: your function must, eventually, start decreasing asymptotically to zero. But eventually is important. Let's try to estimate where this happens.



Consider the ratio $f(30y+30) / f(30y)$, where $y$ is an integer. You have
$$
frac{f(30y+30)}{f(30y)}=frac{Gamma(30y+31)Gamma(15y+1)Gamma(10y+1)Gamma(6y+1)}{Gamma(30y+1)Gamma(15y+16)Gamma(10y+11)Gamma(6y+7)}=frac{(30y+30)!(15y)!(10y)!(6y)!}{(30y)!(15y+15)!(10y+10)!(6y+6)!}=frac{(30y+30)(30y+29)cdots(30y+1)}{(15y+15)(15y+14)cdots(15y+1)cdot(10y+10)cdots(10y+1)cdot(6y+6)cdots(6y+1)}approxfrac{30^{30}}{15^{15}10^{10}6^{6}}frac{1}{y}=frac{1.008times10^{12}}{y},
$$

where the $approx$ is arrived at by pulling out the prefactors, counting powers of $y$, and ignoring the additive terms (which is justified when $y$ is large). This is going to be less than $1$ eventually... when $y$ exceeds a trillion. Your function will start decreasing when $x$ is greater than about $3times 10^{13}.$ By that point, $f(x)$ will have many trillions of decimal digits, which I dare say is a bit more than Excel can handle.






share|cite|improve this answer





















  • Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
    – Larry Freeman
    18 mins ago













up vote
5
down vote



accepted







up vote
5
down vote



accepted






Stirling's approximation says that $log Gamma(z) sim z log z + O(z)$. So $$log Gamma(alpha x + 1)sim (alpha x + 1)log(alpha x + 1)+O(x)sim alpha x log x + O(x),$$
and so certainly $log f(x)sim -frac{1}{30}xlog x + O(x)$: your function must, eventually, start decreasing asymptotically to zero. But eventually is important. Let's try to estimate where this happens.



Consider the ratio $f(30y+30) / f(30y)$, where $y$ is an integer. You have
$$
frac{f(30y+30)}{f(30y)}=frac{Gamma(30y+31)Gamma(15y+1)Gamma(10y+1)Gamma(6y+1)}{Gamma(30y+1)Gamma(15y+16)Gamma(10y+11)Gamma(6y+7)}=frac{(30y+30)!(15y)!(10y)!(6y)!}{(30y)!(15y+15)!(10y+10)!(6y+6)!}=frac{(30y+30)(30y+29)cdots(30y+1)}{(15y+15)(15y+14)cdots(15y+1)cdot(10y+10)cdots(10y+1)cdot(6y+6)cdots(6y+1)}approxfrac{30^{30}}{15^{15}10^{10}6^{6}}frac{1}{y}=frac{1.008times10^{12}}{y},
$$

where the $approx$ is arrived at by pulling out the prefactors, counting powers of $y$, and ignoring the additive terms (which is justified when $y$ is large). This is going to be less than $1$ eventually... when $y$ exceeds a trillion. Your function will start decreasing when $x$ is greater than about $3times 10^{13}.$ By that point, $f(x)$ will have many trillions of decimal digits, which I dare say is a bit more than Excel can handle.






share|cite|improve this answer












Stirling's approximation says that $log Gamma(z) sim z log z + O(z)$. So $$log Gamma(alpha x + 1)sim (alpha x + 1)log(alpha x + 1)+O(x)sim alpha x log x + O(x),$$
and so certainly $log f(x)sim -frac{1}{30}xlog x + O(x)$: your function must, eventually, start decreasing asymptotically to zero. But eventually is important. Let's try to estimate where this happens.



Consider the ratio $f(30y+30) / f(30y)$, where $y$ is an integer. You have
$$
frac{f(30y+30)}{f(30y)}=frac{Gamma(30y+31)Gamma(15y+1)Gamma(10y+1)Gamma(6y+1)}{Gamma(30y+1)Gamma(15y+16)Gamma(10y+11)Gamma(6y+7)}=frac{(30y+30)!(15y)!(10y)!(6y)!}{(30y)!(15y+15)!(10y+10)!(6y+6)!}=frac{(30y+30)(30y+29)cdots(30y+1)}{(15y+15)(15y+14)cdots(15y+1)cdot(10y+10)cdots(10y+1)cdot(6y+6)cdots(6y+1)}approxfrac{30^{30}}{15^{15}10^{10}6^{6}}frac{1}{y}=frac{1.008times10^{12}}{y},
$$

where the $approx$ is arrived at by pulling out the prefactors, counting powers of $y$, and ignoring the additive terms (which is justified when $y$ is large). This is going to be less than $1$ eventually... when $y$ exceeds a trillion. Your function will start decreasing when $x$ is greater than about $3times 10^{13}.$ By that point, $f(x)$ will have many trillions of decimal digits, which I dare say is a bit more than Excel can handle.







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answered yesterday









mjqxxxx

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  • Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
    – Larry Freeman
    18 mins ago


















  • Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
    – Larry Freeman
    18 mins ago
















Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
– Larry Freeman
18 mins ago




Thanks very much! I appreciate your analysis.
– Larry Freeman
18 mins ago


















 

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