Introductory Combinatorics Question











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Have a pretty standard combinatorics question that is causing me some confusion:



During a School's Open Day there are 3 first year, 3 second year and 4 third
year students who have agreed to help. How many different ways can they arrive at the common room in the morning for their briefing



(a) assuming they all arrive at random?



(b) if the first person to enter the room is a first year student, and the last person to enter the room is a third year student?



(c) if all of the third year students arrive in sequence, one after another?



Unsure if (a) is 10!/(3!3!4!) or simply just 10!



Also unsure of how to approach (b) and (c)



Any help would be appreciated.










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    up vote
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    down vote

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    Have a pretty standard combinatorics question that is causing me some confusion:



    During a School's Open Day there are 3 first year, 3 second year and 4 third
    year students who have agreed to help. How many different ways can they arrive at the common room in the morning for their briefing



    (a) assuming they all arrive at random?



    (b) if the first person to enter the room is a first year student, and the last person to enter the room is a third year student?



    (c) if all of the third year students arrive in sequence, one after another?



    Unsure if (a) is 10!/(3!3!4!) or simply just 10!



    Also unsure of how to approach (b) and (c)



    Any help would be appreciated.










    share|cite|improve this question
























      up vote
      0
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      0
      down vote

      favorite











      Have a pretty standard combinatorics question that is causing me some confusion:



      During a School's Open Day there are 3 first year, 3 second year and 4 third
      year students who have agreed to help. How many different ways can they arrive at the common room in the morning for their briefing



      (a) assuming they all arrive at random?



      (b) if the first person to enter the room is a first year student, and the last person to enter the room is a third year student?



      (c) if all of the third year students arrive in sequence, one after another?



      Unsure if (a) is 10!/(3!3!4!) or simply just 10!



      Also unsure of how to approach (b) and (c)



      Any help would be appreciated.










      share|cite|improve this question













      Have a pretty standard combinatorics question that is causing me some confusion:



      During a School's Open Day there are 3 first year, 3 second year and 4 third
      year students who have agreed to help. How many different ways can they arrive at the common room in the morning for their briefing



      (a) assuming they all arrive at random?



      (b) if the first person to enter the room is a first year student, and the last person to enter the room is a third year student?



      (c) if all of the third year students arrive in sequence, one after another?



      Unsure if (a) is 10!/(3!3!4!) or simply just 10!



      Also unsure of how to approach (b) and (c)



      Any help would be appreciated.







      combinatorics






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      asked Nov 13 at 22:28









      hellothere1

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          The students are obviously "distinct", so it's $10!$ for (a): all permutations yield a different arrival order.



          For (b), there are $3$ choices for the first, $4$ for the last, and $8!$ for the remaining, so $3times4times8!$.



          (c) is slightly more tricky: first, there are $4!$ possibilities for the third year students. And obviously $6!$ for the others (just pretend you remove the sequence of 3rd year students from the arrival order). Now, for each of the $6!$ possibilities, the sequence of 3rd year students can be anywhere among the others, and there are $7$ possibilities (before every one else, after the first, ... or after everyone else). So $7times4!times6!$.






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          • Thanks this helped a lot
            – hellothere1
            Nov 13 at 23:07











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          up vote
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          down vote



          accepted










          The students are obviously "distinct", so it's $10!$ for (a): all permutations yield a different arrival order.



          For (b), there are $3$ choices for the first, $4$ for the last, and $8!$ for the remaining, so $3times4times8!$.



          (c) is slightly more tricky: first, there are $4!$ possibilities for the third year students. And obviously $6!$ for the others (just pretend you remove the sequence of 3rd year students from the arrival order). Now, for each of the $6!$ possibilities, the sequence of 3rd year students can be anywhere among the others, and there are $7$ possibilities (before every one else, after the first, ... or after everyone else). So $7times4!times6!$.






          share|cite|improve this answer























          • Thanks this helped a lot
            – hellothere1
            Nov 13 at 23:07















          up vote
          0
          down vote



          accepted










          The students are obviously "distinct", so it's $10!$ for (a): all permutations yield a different arrival order.



          For (b), there are $3$ choices for the first, $4$ for the last, and $8!$ for the remaining, so $3times4times8!$.



          (c) is slightly more tricky: first, there are $4!$ possibilities for the third year students. And obviously $6!$ for the others (just pretend you remove the sequence of 3rd year students from the arrival order). Now, for each of the $6!$ possibilities, the sequence of 3rd year students can be anywhere among the others, and there are $7$ possibilities (before every one else, after the first, ... or after everyone else). So $7times4!times6!$.






          share|cite|improve this answer























          • Thanks this helped a lot
            – hellothere1
            Nov 13 at 23:07













          up vote
          0
          down vote



          accepted







          up vote
          0
          down vote



          accepted






          The students are obviously "distinct", so it's $10!$ for (a): all permutations yield a different arrival order.



          For (b), there are $3$ choices for the first, $4$ for the last, and $8!$ for the remaining, so $3times4times8!$.



          (c) is slightly more tricky: first, there are $4!$ possibilities for the third year students. And obviously $6!$ for the others (just pretend you remove the sequence of 3rd year students from the arrival order). Now, for each of the $6!$ possibilities, the sequence of 3rd year students can be anywhere among the others, and there are $7$ possibilities (before every one else, after the first, ... or after everyone else). So $7times4!times6!$.






          share|cite|improve this answer














          The students are obviously "distinct", so it's $10!$ for (a): all permutations yield a different arrival order.



          For (b), there are $3$ choices for the first, $4$ for the last, and $8!$ for the remaining, so $3times4times8!$.



          (c) is slightly more tricky: first, there are $4!$ possibilities for the third year students. And obviously $6!$ for the others (just pretend you remove the sequence of 3rd year students from the arrival order). Now, for each of the $6!$ possibilities, the sequence of 3rd year students can be anywhere among the others, and there are $7$ possibilities (before every one else, after the first, ... or after everyone else). So $7times4!times6!$.







          share|cite|improve this answer














          share|cite|improve this answer



          share|cite|improve this answer








          edited Nov 13 at 23:08

























          answered Nov 13 at 22:49









          Jean-Claude Arbaut

          14.3k63361




          14.3k63361












          • Thanks this helped a lot
            – hellothere1
            Nov 13 at 23:07


















          • Thanks this helped a lot
            – hellothere1
            Nov 13 at 23:07
















          Thanks this helped a lot
          – hellothere1
          Nov 13 at 23:07




          Thanks this helped a lot
          – hellothere1
          Nov 13 at 23:07


















           

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