Prove J is an ideal.











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I understand that first i must check J is a subring then prove right & left ideals. My question is the notation on the elements in I. How would i subtract/multiply 2 functions of I.










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    ... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Nov 18 at 23:34










  • sorry my question only concerns part (a).
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:36










  • to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • $I$ is not defined in this post.
    – Matt Samuel
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • I meant to write J not I, sorry.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:41















up vote
0
down vote

favorite












enter image description here



I understand that first i must check J is a subring then prove right & left ideals. My question is the notation on the elements in I. How would i subtract/multiply 2 functions of I.










share|cite|improve this question




















  • 1




    ... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Nov 18 at 23:34










  • sorry my question only concerns part (a).
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:36










  • to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • $I$ is not defined in this post.
    – Matt Samuel
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • I meant to write J not I, sorry.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:41













up vote
0
down vote

favorite









up vote
0
down vote

favorite











enter image description here



I understand that first i must check J is a subring then prove right & left ideals. My question is the notation on the elements in I. How would i subtract/multiply 2 functions of I.










share|cite|improve this question















enter image description here



I understand that first i must check J is a subring then prove right & left ideals. My question is the notation on the elements in I. How would i subtract/multiply 2 functions of I.







abstract-algebra ideals






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edited Nov 19 at 0:02









The R

516




516










asked Nov 18 at 23:30









H.B

203




203








  • 1




    ... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Nov 18 at 23:34










  • sorry my question only concerns part (a).
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:36










  • to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • $I$ is not defined in this post.
    – Matt Samuel
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • I meant to write J not I, sorry.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:41














  • 1




    ... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
    – Hagen von Eitzen
    Nov 18 at 23:34










  • sorry my question only concerns part (a).
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:36










  • to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • $I$ is not defined in this post.
    – Matt Samuel
    Nov 18 at 23:39










  • I meant to write J not I, sorry.
    – H.B
    Nov 18 at 23:41








1




1




... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
– Hagen von Eitzen
Nov 18 at 23:34




... or note that $J$ is the kernel of the canonical ring homomorphism $Bbb Z[x]to Bbb F_2[x]$. -- But what is the $I$ that later occurs?
– Hagen von Eitzen
Nov 18 at 23:34












sorry my question only concerns part (a).
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:36




sorry my question only concerns part (a).
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:36












to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:39




to check J is an ideal, i must check it is non empty, closed under subtraction and multiplication. Finally i must check that J absorbs products. My confusion is how to deal with the functions in J. For example how would i show f(x)-g(x) is closed for f(x),g(x) in J.
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:39












$I$ is not defined in this post.
– Matt Samuel
Nov 18 at 23:39




$I$ is not defined in this post.
– Matt Samuel
Nov 18 at 23:39












I meant to write J not I, sorry.
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:41




I meant to write J not I, sorry.
– H.B
Nov 18 at 23:41










2 Answers
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Consider general arbitrary elements $P,Q in J$, and an element $R in mathbb{Z}[x]$.



Then clearly $P(x)R(x)$ has even coefficients because the product of any integer with an even integer is even, thus $R(x) in J$.



Furthermore, $P(x) + Q(x)$ must also have even coefficients because the sum of any two even numbers is again even.



This is sufficient, and proves that $J$ is an ideal.



(If you're unsure why this is sufficient, consider why these conditions imply that $(J,+)$ is a subgroup of $(mathbb{Z}[x]$,+) and $jr in J$ for all $j in J, r in R$ - these are precisely the requirements of a (two-sided) ideal).



Edit: In terms of notation, because we're talking about polynomials here you consider multiplication of functions to be exactly the multiplication you'd expect, e.g. $(x^2 + 2)(x + 1) = x^3 + x^2 + 2x + 2 in mathbb{Z}[x]$. The same for addition.






share|cite|improve this answer






























    up vote
    0
    down vote













    Perhaps it would help to see this problem solved more explicitly. We first note that $0 = 2cdot 0 in J$, so $J neq emptyset$. I will consider the case of $f(X) - g(X)$. Consider $f(X),g(X) in J$. Then we have $f(X) = a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0$ and $g(X) = b_mX^m + b_{m-1}X^{m-1} + dotsb + b_0$ with $a_n,a_{n-1},dotsc,a_0 in 2Bbb Z$ and $ b_m,b_{m-1},dotsc,b_0 in 2Bbb{Z}$. That is, $a_i = 2a'_i$ and $b_j = 2b'_j$ for $i = 1,dotsc,n$ and for $j = 1,dotsc,m$. For convenience, suppose $m leq n$ and let $b_j = 0$ for $m < j leq n$ if $m < n$. Thus we may assume $m = n$. We have
    $$begin{align}f(X) - g(X) &= left(a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0right) - left(b_nX^n + b_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + b_0right)\
    &= (a_n - b_n)X^n + (a_{n-1} - b_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + (a_0 - b_0)\
    &= 2(a'_n - b'_n)X^n + 2(a'_{n-1} - b'_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + 2(a'_0 + b'_0) in J.end{align}$$

    Thus $f(X) - g(X) in J$ for $f(X),g(X) in J$ and so $J$ has the structure of an abelian group. That $J$ is closed under multiplication follows similarly, and could prove fruitful to write down explicitly such a problem at least once.






    share|cite|improve this answer





















    • Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
      – H.B
      Nov 19 at 0:55










    • I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
      – Thomas Chansler
      Nov 19 at 10:38











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    2 Answers
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    Consider general arbitrary elements $P,Q in J$, and an element $R in mathbb{Z}[x]$.



    Then clearly $P(x)R(x)$ has even coefficients because the product of any integer with an even integer is even, thus $R(x) in J$.



    Furthermore, $P(x) + Q(x)$ must also have even coefficients because the sum of any two even numbers is again even.



    This is sufficient, and proves that $J$ is an ideal.



    (If you're unsure why this is sufficient, consider why these conditions imply that $(J,+)$ is a subgroup of $(mathbb{Z}[x]$,+) and $jr in J$ for all $j in J, r in R$ - these are precisely the requirements of a (two-sided) ideal).



    Edit: In terms of notation, because we're talking about polynomials here you consider multiplication of functions to be exactly the multiplication you'd expect, e.g. $(x^2 + 2)(x + 1) = x^3 + x^2 + 2x + 2 in mathbb{Z}[x]$. The same for addition.






    share|cite|improve this answer



























      up vote
      0
      down vote













      Consider general arbitrary elements $P,Q in J$, and an element $R in mathbb{Z}[x]$.



      Then clearly $P(x)R(x)$ has even coefficients because the product of any integer with an even integer is even, thus $R(x) in J$.



      Furthermore, $P(x) + Q(x)$ must also have even coefficients because the sum of any two even numbers is again even.



      This is sufficient, and proves that $J$ is an ideal.



      (If you're unsure why this is sufficient, consider why these conditions imply that $(J,+)$ is a subgroup of $(mathbb{Z}[x]$,+) and $jr in J$ for all $j in J, r in R$ - these are precisely the requirements of a (two-sided) ideal).



      Edit: In terms of notation, because we're talking about polynomials here you consider multiplication of functions to be exactly the multiplication you'd expect, e.g. $(x^2 + 2)(x + 1) = x^3 + x^2 + 2x + 2 in mathbb{Z}[x]$. The same for addition.






      share|cite|improve this answer

























        up vote
        0
        down vote










        up vote
        0
        down vote









        Consider general arbitrary elements $P,Q in J$, and an element $R in mathbb{Z}[x]$.



        Then clearly $P(x)R(x)$ has even coefficients because the product of any integer with an even integer is even, thus $R(x) in J$.



        Furthermore, $P(x) + Q(x)$ must also have even coefficients because the sum of any two even numbers is again even.



        This is sufficient, and proves that $J$ is an ideal.



        (If you're unsure why this is sufficient, consider why these conditions imply that $(J,+)$ is a subgroup of $(mathbb{Z}[x]$,+) and $jr in J$ for all $j in J, r in R$ - these are precisely the requirements of a (two-sided) ideal).



        Edit: In terms of notation, because we're talking about polynomials here you consider multiplication of functions to be exactly the multiplication you'd expect, e.g. $(x^2 + 2)(x + 1) = x^3 + x^2 + 2x + 2 in mathbb{Z}[x]$. The same for addition.






        share|cite|improve this answer














        Consider general arbitrary elements $P,Q in J$, and an element $R in mathbb{Z}[x]$.



        Then clearly $P(x)R(x)$ has even coefficients because the product of any integer with an even integer is even, thus $R(x) in J$.



        Furthermore, $P(x) + Q(x)$ must also have even coefficients because the sum of any two even numbers is again even.



        This is sufficient, and proves that $J$ is an ideal.



        (If you're unsure why this is sufficient, consider why these conditions imply that $(J,+)$ is a subgroup of $(mathbb{Z}[x]$,+) and $jr in J$ for all $j in J, r in R$ - these are precisely the requirements of a (two-sided) ideal).



        Edit: In terms of notation, because we're talking about polynomials here you consider multiplication of functions to be exactly the multiplication you'd expect, e.g. $(x^2 + 2)(x + 1) = x^3 + x^2 + 2x + 2 in mathbb{Z}[x]$. The same for addition.







        share|cite|improve this answer














        share|cite|improve this answer



        share|cite|improve this answer








        edited Nov 19 at 0:01

























        answered Nov 18 at 23:52









        Stuartg98

        385




        385






















            up vote
            0
            down vote













            Perhaps it would help to see this problem solved more explicitly. We first note that $0 = 2cdot 0 in J$, so $J neq emptyset$. I will consider the case of $f(X) - g(X)$. Consider $f(X),g(X) in J$. Then we have $f(X) = a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0$ and $g(X) = b_mX^m + b_{m-1}X^{m-1} + dotsb + b_0$ with $a_n,a_{n-1},dotsc,a_0 in 2Bbb Z$ and $ b_m,b_{m-1},dotsc,b_0 in 2Bbb{Z}$. That is, $a_i = 2a'_i$ and $b_j = 2b'_j$ for $i = 1,dotsc,n$ and for $j = 1,dotsc,m$. For convenience, suppose $m leq n$ and let $b_j = 0$ for $m < j leq n$ if $m < n$. Thus we may assume $m = n$. We have
            $$begin{align}f(X) - g(X) &= left(a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0right) - left(b_nX^n + b_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + b_0right)\
            &= (a_n - b_n)X^n + (a_{n-1} - b_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + (a_0 - b_0)\
            &= 2(a'_n - b'_n)X^n + 2(a'_{n-1} - b'_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + 2(a'_0 + b'_0) in J.end{align}$$

            Thus $f(X) - g(X) in J$ for $f(X),g(X) in J$ and so $J$ has the structure of an abelian group. That $J$ is closed under multiplication follows similarly, and could prove fruitful to write down explicitly such a problem at least once.






            share|cite|improve this answer





















            • Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
              – H.B
              Nov 19 at 0:55










            • I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
              – Thomas Chansler
              Nov 19 at 10:38















            up vote
            0
            down vote













            Perhaps it would help to see this problem solved more explicitly. We first note that $0 = 2cdot 0 in J$, so $J neq emptyset$. I will consider the case of $f(X) - g(X)$. Consider $f(X),g(X) in J$. Then we have $f(X) = a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0$ and $g(X) = b_mX^m + b_{m-1}X^{m-1} + dotsb + b_0$ with $a_n,a_{n-1},dotsc,a_0 in 2Bbb Z$ and $ b_m,b_{m-1},dotsc,b_0 in 2Bbb{Z}$. That is, $a_i = 2a'_i$ and $b_j = 2b'_j$ for $i = 1,dotsc,n$ and for $j = 1,dotsc,m$. For convenience, suppose $m leq n$ and let $b_j = 0$ for $m < j leq n$ if $m < n$. Thus we may assume $m = n$. We have
            $$begin{align}f(X) - g(X) &= left(a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0right) - left(b_nX^n + b_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + b_0right)\
            &= (a_n - b_n)X^n + (a_{n-1} - b_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + (a_0 - b_0)\
            &= 2(a'_n - b'_n)X^n + 2(a'_{n-1} - b'_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + 2(a'_0 + b'_0) in J.end{align}$$

            Thus $f(X) - g(X) in J$ for $f(X),g(X) in J$ and so $J$ has the structure of an abelian group. That $J$ is closed under multiplication follows similarly, and could prove fruitful to write down explicitly such a problem at least once.






            share|cite|improve this answer





















            • Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
              – H.B
              Nov 19 at 0:55










            • I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
              – Thomas Chansler
              Nov 19 at 10:38













            up vote
            0
            down vote










            up vote
            0
            down vote









            Perhaps it would help to see this problem solved more explicitly. We first note that $0 = 2cdot 0 in J$, so $J neq emptyset$. I will consider the case of $f(X) - g(X)$. Consider $f(X),g(X) in J$. Then we have $f(X) = a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0$ and $g(X) = b_mX^m + b_{m-1}X^{m-1} + dotsb + b_0$ with $a_n,a_{n-1},dotsc,a_0 in 2Bbb Z$ and $ b_m,b_{m-1},dotsc,b_0 in 2Bbb{Z}$. That is, $a_i = 2a'_i$ and $b_j = 2b'_j$ for $i = 1,dotsc,n$ and for $j = 1,dotsc,m$. For convenience, suppose $m leq n$ and let $b_j = 0$ for $m < j leq n$ if $m < n$. Thus we may assume $m = n$. We have
            $$begin{align}f(X) - g(X) &= left(a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0right) - left(b_nX^n + b_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + b_0right)\
            &= (a_n - b_n)X^n + (a_{n-1} - b_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + (a_0 - b_0)\
            &= 2(a'_n - b'_n)X^n + 2(a'_{n-1} - b'_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + 2(a'_0 + b'_0) in J.end{align}$$

            Thus $f(X) - g(X) in J$ for $f(X),g(X) in J$ and so $J$ has the structure of an abelian group. That $J$ is closed under multiplication follows similarly, and could prove fruitful to write down explicitly such a problem at least once.






            share|cite|improve this answer












            Perhaps it would help to see this problem solved more explicitly. We first note that $0 = 2cdot 0 in J$, so $J neq emptyset$. I will consider the case of $f(X) - g(X)$. Consider $f(X),g(X) in J$. Then we have $f(X) = a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0$ and $g(X) = b_mX^m + b_{m-1}X^{m-1} + dotsb + b_0$ with $a_n,a_{n-1},dotsc,a_0 in 2Bbb Z$ and $ b_m,b_{m-1},dotsc,b_0 in 2Bbb{Z}$. That is, $a_i = 2a'_i$ and $b_j = 2b'_j$ for $i = 1,dotsc,n$ and for $j = 1,dotsc,m$. For convenience, suppose $m leq n$ and let $b_j = 0$ for $m < j leq n$ if $m < n$. Thus we may assume $m = n$. We have
            $$begin{align}f(X) - g(X) &= left(a_nX^n + a_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + a_0right) - left(b_nX^n + b_{n-1}X^{n-1} + dotsb + b_0right)\
            &= (a_n - b_n)X^n + (a_{n-1} - b_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + (a_0 - b_0)\
            &= 2(a'_n - b'_n)X^n + 2(a'_{n-1} - b'_{n-1})X^{n-1} + dotsb + 2(a'_0 + b'_0) in J.end{align}$$

            Thus $f(X) - g(X) in J$ for $f(X),g(X) in J$ and so $J$ has the structure of an abelian group. That $J$ is closed under multiplication follows similarly, and could prove fruitful to write down explicitly such a problem at least once.







            share|cite|improve this answer












            share|cite|improve this answer



            share|cite|improve this answer










            answered Nov 19 at 0:21









            Thomas Chansler

            204




            204












            • Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
              – H.B
              Nov 19 at 0:55










            • I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
              – Thomas Chansler
              Nov 19 at 10:38


















            • Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
              – H.B
              Nov 19 at 0:55










            • I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
              – Thomas Chansler
              Nov 19 at 10:38
















            Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
            – H.B
            Nov 19 at 0:55




            Yes this helps a lot !! I just needed to see how I would write this in a formal proof.
            – H.B
            Nov 19 at 0:55












            I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
            – Thomas Chansler
            Nov 19 at 10:38




            I highly recommend the multiplicative case as an exercise then. I recall elementary symmetric polynomials here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elementary_symmetric_polynomial
            – Thomas Chansler
            Nov 19 at 10:38


















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